Devale and Khadeen Ellis joined Nessa for an actual speak on marriage, parenting 4 boys, and why they rebranded their present to Ellis Ever After. They get into holding intimacy and friendship when schedules are packed, setting boundaries with social media, dealing with public suggestions after a viral monogamy debate, and the way they determine what to share about their household. They additionally open up about grief, communication guidelines that cease arguments from spiraling, and the second they nearly ended the podcast—plus why they selected to maintain going.

They share classes from dropping all the things in 2008 and rebuilding collectively, elevating emotionally conscious sons who get a say in what’s posted, and what they discovered co-producing Othello on Broadway with Denzel Washington and Jake Gyllenhaal. Devale talks progress from the NFL to appearing, Khadeen breaks down constructing a personality from the bottom up, and collectively they clarify the “we over me” mindset, love languages, and the way they reset after they hit a rut. Listen to their podcast, Ellis Ever After, out now.